2

KJV Isaiah 59: (20) And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD. (21) As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever.

We know that the apostles were beneficiaries of the new covenant and their mouths were supernaturally filled with God's messages but what about their children and grandchildren? What of their seed today?

Improve this question
3
  • The words expressed by the apostles are still expressed today (by those who faithfully express them).
    – Nigel J
    Commented Nov 13, 2018 at 19:27
  • Isaiah 59:21 has nothing to do with the infallibility of all Jews, just as Matthew 16:18 has nothing to do with the infallibility of all Christians.
    – Lucian
    Commented Nov 17, 2018 at 13:34
  • So what does it have to do with?
    – Ruminator
    Commented Nov 17, 2018 at 13:43

2 Answers 2

Reset to default
2

I cannot see that Isa 59:21 implies infallibility. It is simply discussing the requirement of God's people, the "covenant" people to preach the Word and the Gospel (1 Cor 9:16). The NT is full of examples of those who preached the (inspired) words of God being imperfect.

  • Paul and Barnabas had a very "sharp" dispute that led directly to their parting, unable to work together. Acts 15:36-40
  • Peter behaved badly toward Gentile believers and had to be admonished by Paul. Gal 2:11
  • Timothy had to be corrected about some of his habits. 1 Tim 5:23
  • Jesus had to rebuke Peter about Peter's betrayal. John 21:15-19
  • Jesus had to rebuke Thomas for his doubting. John 20:29
  • Jesus had to very gently correct and encourage the greatest prophet in John the Baptist when he was told "blessed is he who does not fall away on account of me" (Matt 11:3, 6).
  • Many of the OT patriarch made terrible mistakes and were far from infallible as is well known.

This is part of the genius of the Gospel - God uses very human vessels (2 Tim 2:21) with all their problems (Rom 3:9-18) to accomplish great things (John 14:12). Even Paul described himself as "chief of sinners" (1 Tim 1:15).

Therefore, I see Isa 59:21 simply as a prophecy that God's Word(s) would always be preached by His "covenant" people. Essentially, Jesus repeated this in Matt 28:19, 2 Tim 4:2, 2 Cor 2:17 etc. My reading of history suggests that this has always been true, despite the limitations of our humanity.

Improve this answer
7
  • Are you saying that you read "shall not depart" as a command?
    – Ruminator
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 22:27
  • “who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” ‭‭John‬ ‭1:13‬ ‭The descendants are to be born of God and in their mouth the words of Isaiah will ring true. I really agree with the last paragraph @mac’smusings
    – Nihil Sine Deo
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 22:28
  • What about the fact that he refers to: 1) the new covenant (with Israel); 2) "Zion"; 3) "in Jacob"?
    – Ruminator
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 22:58
  • @Ruminator if you’re asking me the New Covenant was with Israel which is the Church and the ten lost tribes can re-enter into covenant via John 1:13 not by blood lineage anymore and Romans 7 explains how if the first husband, Jesus (the angel on mt.Sinai) dies the divorced wife can remarry. Judah is reference to the two tribes that remained, Judah and Benjamin or Jews. Acts 26:7 essentially calls the church the twelve tribes, the ten lost tribes mixed with gentiles can come in under the New Covenant. It’s all consistent. It was always about Israel and in this seed all the nations would return
    – Nihil Sine Deo
    Commented Apr 13, 2019 at 1:27
  • 1
    @Autodidact You or Mac. I've never contemplated your specific view which looks well thought out. But I think this would be better explored in a separate post.
    – Ruminator
    Commented Apr 13, 2019 at 1:31
2

Isaiah 59:21 is not about infallible persons but about inspired persons. Isaiah was not an infallible person as shown in Isaiah 6:5

"Woe to me!" I cried. "I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King, the LORD Almighty."

Isaiah 59:21 New International Version

"As for me, this is my covenant with them," says the LORD. "My Spirit, who is on you, will not depart from you, and my words that I have put in your mouth will always be on your lips, on the lips of your children and on the lips of their descendants--from this time on and forever," says the LORD.

of your children,
זַרְעֲךָ֜ (zar·‘ă·ḵā)
Noun - masculine singular construct | second person masculine singular
Strong's Hebrew 2233: Seed, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity

As for modern day inspirations, we have John 14:26

But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

Having said this, I'm not against the possibility of an Isaiah-like person showing up in the future.

Improve this answer

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge you have read our privacy policy.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.