I have heard it said that 1 Timothy 2:11,12 is to be examined through the "lens" of culture but what Paul writes right after it in verses 13 and 14 seems to nullify that.
A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. 12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.
A Socio-cultural hermeneutical approach is the worst way to interpret scripture, since this approach is usually based on extra-biblical sources, and allows anyone to interpret any scripture any way they want. You can always find some instance of ancient culture that will allow you to interpret scripture in the way that bests suits you, also known as eisegesis.
The most important criteria when interpreting a passage of scripture is to look at other scriptures. Scripture is the best interpreter of itself. So some other passages:
Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.
Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. 35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
And the one most directly related to the Timothy passage, Genesis 3:16
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
The point you bring up of God's design is the important one, here's an excerpt from this essay which addresses the importance of the creation order:
These attempts to relativize Paul’s prohibition must be judged to be unsuccessful. Paul could have easily written, “I don’t want women to teach or exercise authority over men because they are uneducated,” or, “I don’t want women to teach or exercise authority over men because they are spreading false teaching.” Yet what reason does Paul actually give for his command in verse 12? Paul’s rationale for the command follows in the next verse: “For Adam was formed first, then Eve” (v. 13). Paul says nothing about lack of education or about women promulgating the false teaching. Instead, he appeals to the created order, to God’s good and perfect intention when he formed human beings. It is imperative to see that the reference to creation indicates that the command for women not to teach or exercise authority over men is a transcultural word, a prohibition that is binding on the church at all times and in all places. In giving this command, Paul does not appeal to fallen creation, to the consequences that pertain to human life as a result of sin. Rather, he grounds the prohibition in the wholly good creation that existed before sin entered into the world.
The fundamental reason that women should not serve as pastors is communicated here, and so the argument from creation cannot be dismissed as culturally limited. Moreover, the New Testament contains many similar appeals to the created order. For instance, homosexuality is not in accord with the will of God because it is “contrary to nature” (Rom. 1:26); that is, it violates what God intended when he made human beings as male and female (Gen. 1:26-27). Similarly, Jesus teaches that divorce is not the divine ideal since at creation God made one man and one woman, signifying that one man should be married to one woman “till death do us part” (Matt. 19:3-12). So, too, all food is to be received gratefully since it is a gift from God’s creative hand (1 Tim. 4:3-5).
In 1 Timothy 2:11-15, Paul specifically grounds his prohibition of women teaching and exercising authority in the order of creation, namely, that Adam was made first and then Eve (Gen. 2:4-25). The narrative in Genesis is carefully constructed, and Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, helps us see the significance of Eve being created after Adam. Critics occasionally object that the argument fails to persuade since animals were created before human beings, but this misses Paul’s point. Only human beings are created in God’s image (Gen. 1:26-27), and therefore Paul communicates the significance of God creating man prior to the woman, namely, that the man is responsible to lead.
It says "I do not permit" and does not say "God commands thus..." or "You must not permit", suggesting Paul is speaking in his own conclusive mind; because elsewhere in the letter he does say "must" (1 Timothy 3:2-12). Though these are all translations, and might not mean the same in the native language in which it was written.
Heb 10.1 ¶ For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, ...
The literal appoach to scripture offers no meaning from the text for 'shadows'. Yet if we do not understand the shadows, we do not really understand the law.
When Paul speaks of marriage, though it is clear to all who read his teaching that he is speaking of marriage, he plainly states that he is not speaking of marriage:
Eph 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
In Day 6 of creation, the man and his bride are a shadow of Christ and his bride. There can be no denying that the bride of Christ includes men and women... therefore we are not speaking of literal gender.
Timothy understands the shadow. The letter to Timothy was not written in a vacuum, but in the context of Paul's teaching, including that in his letters to the Corinthians that all should prophesy, including literal women.
Speaking of the woman being deceived, Paul is not holding all women accountable for Eve's deception, nor is he indicating that all women are more susceptible to deception. Eve was not indicted by God for having sinned first, but that sin came into the world by the man:
Ro 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Apparently it was a lessor crime to have been deceived than to have sinned. Therefore it is wrong to interpret Paul's saying as a punishment for Eve's actions.
Paul is using Eve as a shadow or a figure for those who are 'blind' or do not understand no matter what their actual gender is.
Since he says that all should prophesy, there are two reasons why he doesn't plainly state it here:
He does not wish to cause a cultural disturbance.
He is inviting us to intentionally live 'dinner theater' portraying Christ in the same manner that OT saints did unknowingly, and Jesus did intentionally.
In Corinth, women were participating and the men were complaining about it. Paul's sharp rebuke after lulling them into ease concerning their prejudice is a masterful play in Greek rhetoric.
1Co 14:36 ¶ What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?
But in the more conservative community where Timothy served, openly advocating that women should participate would cause a social stir and distract from the preaching of the gospel.
How can he say what he wishes to Timothy without causing such a stir, and what did he say?
Clement of Alexandria states that there are some things that he only taught face to face, and would not commit to writing because they would be misunderstood by some. These things are part of the "mystical" tradition of the church. But since we now live in communities more akin to Corinth, we can speak plainly of them, without causing the cultural stir.
Since the woman represents the blind, and the man the seeing one. Paul only permits those who understand to teach (figuratively men), and those who do not understand to learn in quiet submission (figuratively female). If a genetic female understands, then she is a metaphoric male. Christ is the male, and his bride, though made up of men and women, are called female because they relatively do not see as well as Christ.
The riddle of Jeremiah can now be understood:
Jer 30:6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?
Jeremiah says men will become pregnant. Incidently, the riddle is shared by extra-biblical sources which should not be taken as authorities, but are offered as examples that the genre of riddle, and this particular riddle was more widely known than we may expect. The Gospel of Thomas teaches that women must become male. The Sikhs have a saying that men must become virgins.
These are all made clear with the metaphor that the female is 'blind'.
GOT: The blind must see.
Sikh: Those who see must become the virgin bride of Christ.
Jeremiah: The bride of Christ (which understands) will be fruitful and multiply.
Virgin: The fruitfulness is not a physical fruitfulness, but a spiritual fruitfulness.
The reason that Jesus was born of a virgin, is to say metaphorically that children of God are born spiritually. They are not of the flesh. He is the 'first-born'.
To Timothy, Paul said that those who understand should teach, but do not cause a social upheaval. Instead knowledgeable women will role play the position of the church to Christ, in the same manner that prophets of old role played their messages. They become a living testimony of Christ and the church.
It is a privilege to be invited to be a living shadow of Christ. It is a shame that so many interpret it to be a punishment for someone else's misunderstanding.
How is this passage on the authority of women to be interpreted? 1Timothy 2:11-12
The overseers of a congregation are described in the Bible as being males. The 12 apostles of Jesus Christ were all males, and those later appointed to be overseers and ministerial servants in Christian congregations were males.
Matthew 10:1-2a (NASB)
10 Jesus summoned His twelve disciples and gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every kind of disease and every kind of sickness 2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these:
1 Timothy 3:2 (NASB)
2 An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
1 Timothy 3:12 (NASB)
12 Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and [a]good managers of their children and their own households
Women counseled to learn in silence.
Women are counseled to “learn in silence with all submissiveness” at congregation meetings, in that they do not raise questions challenging the men in the congregation. The women are ‘not to speak’ at such meetings if what they might say would demonstrate lack of subjection.
1 Timothy 2:11-12(NASB)
11 A woman must quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness. 12 But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.
1 Corinthians 14:33-34 (NASB)
33 for God is not a God of confusion but of [a]peace, as in all the churches of the saints. 34 The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says.
To interpret 1 Timothy 2:11-14 regarding the role of women in teaching and authority, it's essential to consider both the specific cultural and situational context in which Paul was writing and how this aligns with broader biblical principles and Jesus's teachings.
The Words of Jesus as Central: "No theology is above the words of Jesus," as Jesus's teachings set the foundational tone for Christian ethics and inclusivity. In Jesus's ministry, women played significant roles in spreading his message and interacting publicly in ways that would have been unconventional at the time. For instance, the Samaritan woman at Jacob's well became an evangelist in her town after her encounter with Jesus (John 4), and Martha had deep theological conversations with Jesus, openly expressing faith in him (John 11:21-27). These examples demonstrate that Jesus valued women's insights and allowed them to discuss and share teachings openly.
Differentiating Deception and Transgression: In the passage, Paul refers to Eve being deceived, while Adam's sin is characterized by knowingly transgressing (Genesis 3). Eve’s deception by the serpent shows a failure in discernment rather than deliberate disobedience. Adam, however, knowingly disobeyed God’s command after receiving it directly, making his act a more conscious transgression. This nuance could imply that Paul's intent may not have been to permanently bar women from teaching but rather to address specific concerns in the Ephesian church, perhaps cautioning against potential misunderstandings or disruptions that could stem from misinterpretations of the creation narrative.
Paul's Distinct Ministry and Teachings: Paul was not directly part of Jesus’s original ministry or of the early apostolic circle that walked with Jesus. His apostleship, while legitimate, involved contextualizing the gospel to a different cultural audience, which sometimes led to statements tailored to particular situations, such as the structure of worship and authority in Ephesus. His struggles in gaining acceptance, even stating, "all who are in the province of Asia have deserted me" (2 Timothy 1:15), hint at challenges he faced in this region, potentially stemming from doctrinal or cultural tensions. Revelation’s opening letter to the seven churches of Asia, which includes Ephesus (Revelation 1:4), indicates the importance of Asia Minor as both a Christian stronghold and a region where teachings were hotly contested.
Asia Minor’s Influence on Early Christianity: Asia Minor, particularly Ephesus, was a vibrant and influential center for the spread and preservation of Christian teachings. As a leader of the Ephesian church, Paul may have emphasized certain guidelines to address local challenges or maintain harmony, knowing that Ephesus was crucial in shaping the Christian message.
In light of these points, it’s plausible that 1 Timothy 2:11-14 should be understood as addressing a specific issue rather than establishing a universal restriction on women’s roles. Throughout the New Testament, women like Priscilla, Phoebe, and others are recognized as significant leaders and teachers in the early church. The cultural tensions and situational considerations may have led Paul to express a temporary restraint to maintain order, rather than setting a binding, timeless doctrine on gender roles within the church.
This link makes a compelling case that Paul is referring to the the apocryphal scroll, "The Life of Adam and Eve" aka "Apocalypse of Moses". He also shows compellingly that said scroll is also the background of:
[2Co 11:13-15 NLT] (13) These people are false apostles. They are deceitful workers who disguise themselves as apostles of Christ. (14) But I am not surprised! Even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. (15) So it is no wonder that his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. In the end they will get the punishment their wicked deeds deserve.
And another possible allusion to the scroll here:
[2Co 12:2 NLT] (2) I was caught up to the third heaven fourteen years ago. Whether I was in my body or out of my body, I don't know--only God knows.
All men on here that don’t agree, or give excuse to verses with weakness of saying imperfects etc show they are not men of God, and they don’t deserve to have a voice as a woman.
