Timeline for Who is our Savior: God or Jesus?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
10 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Aug 17, 2021 at 9:53 | comment | added | Anne | You were the first to say in comments that “God cannot die”. You surely believe that? (as do I). I simply agreed with your initial statement. | |
| Aug 17, 2021 at 9:50 | comment | added | Anne | You are now asking a different Q to the one you first asked. You must ask a new Q to keep to the rules of Hermeneutics. But God not dying is the same as God not lying! Neither means that “he cannot do everything” unless you want a man-made construct of a God who is just like humans? To die for the sins of the world there had to be a change which was not contrary to the fact that the Word, who made everything, made humanity in the image of God, so when he added human nature to his divine nature, he was remaining true to himself. But I won't debate this on comments. Again, that is a distinct Q. | |
| Aug 17, 2021 at 9:37 | comment | added | Steve | @Anne "agreed with the Father before creation", "Word agreeing to become incarnate at a future time" This is Biblical H. Is there any biblical support for this construct? Anyway, you've been distracted from the topic. You have said the Father cannot die. So, yes, obviously God cannot do everything! | |
| Aug 17, 2021 at 8:12 | comment | added | Anne | @Michael, the Q is not about the ultimate, uncaused God, but asks if there are 2 divine Saviours. I know the Trinity doctrine shows the Son to be the only-begotten but it does not say that’s an alternative word for ‘creation’. It maintains the unique roles and inter-related harmony of the three uncreated ‘persons’ in the one Being of God (the Godhead). Isaiah 43:11:” Apart from me there is no saviour” Hosea 13:4 “You shall acknowledge no God but me, no Saviour except me”. But Christians acknowledge the risen Christ as Lord and Saviour, without contradiction! | |
| Aug 17, 2021 at 8:03 | comment | added | Anne | Given that the Word of God, who later became the man, Jesus, agreed with the Father before creation started as to this plan of salvation, it was designed by them to the nth degree way back in eternity, the Word agreeing to become incarnate at a future time. It wasn’t a case of ‘could not’, but ‘would not’ save us without the incarnation. The Father did not die. The Son died and rose in triumph as he was sinless. The plan was determined and as good as done way back before Jesus came, Rev. 13:8 saying he is the “Lamb slain from the creation of the world”. | |
| Aug 16, 2021 at 13:23 | comment | added | Michael16 | @Anne, the Catholic and Orthodox creeds do state that the Father alone is the ultimate uncaused God, while the Son is begotten (alternative word for creation) as well as the Spirit. So it is a Catholic doctrine that holds hierarchy and status in the Trinity. | |
| Aug 16, 2021 at 12:52 | history | edited | Steve | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Aug 16, 2021 at 12:22 | comment | added | Steve | @Anne apols, never saw your comment till now. Yes, He could not save by the means chosen - to have a sinless man who would die as the Lamb, without Jesus. As the Saviour God, He had a plan, that plan required Jesus. Just as the plan required the serpent. God couldn't fulfil either task by Himself. God cannot die! God cannot tempt or do evil. | |
| Apr 21, 2021 at 14:47 | comment | added | Anne | By saying God the Father is the ultimate Saviour, are you implying that there is a penultimate Saviour? If so. that would infer that you believe there are two Saviours -the main Saviour and a subsidiary, secondary Saviour. And by saying 'God... could not save without the Lamb, the logos", if you think the Lamb was created by God, then you are really saying that God is limited in what he can do, needing to rely on one of his creatures to do work on his behalf which he could not have done himself. Or have I misunderstood your answer? | |
| Apr 18, 2021 at 5:56 | history | answered | Steve | CC BY-SA 4.0 |