Romans 9:5 Is this a scriptural evidence for Pauline Trinitarian Christology

Question

I am asking this question because it seems to me that Romans 9:5 as per its translation will assert that Christ is indeed God, but the problem I am faced with now is the fact that there seems to be a lot of translations and with every translation a different meaning.

For example in the NIV, it is stated as such, "Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of the Messiah, who is God over all, forever praised! Amen."

But if you take the RSV, it is stated as such, "… of their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ. God who is over all be blessed for ever. Amen."

Now if you take a look at the KJV, it is written, " Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen."

The problem I am faced with is that in the NIV it states that the Messiah is God over all, but in the KJV it states that Christ is God blessed i.e., blessed by God forever which totally and wholly redirects the whole meaning of the deity of the Messiah.

So now, I am trying to see which interpretation is more plausible and correct. My best bet is NIV but I am not sure.

Edit: Will this by any means help because it seems to be slightly a bit less ambiguous and support the former version and is very proximal to the Romans 9. Romans 8:9 "You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ."

And what does this edit mean does this actually support Romans 9 and therefore also support Paul's Trinitarian Christology?!

Answer 1

It is grammatically more natural to opt for the version that "who" here simply qualifies and describes Christ of the previous clause and thus Christ is acclaimed as God by Paul, as he, again, grammatically more plausibly (according to the famous Granville Sharp's law) calls Christ "Great God and Savior" in Titus 2:13.

But Paul calls Christ "God" also without any equivocation in Hebrews 1:8.

Moreover, Paul definitely affirms the role of Christ in creation of the entirety of the created order of the universe, visible and invisible (Colossians 1:16; Hebrews 1:2), which means that Christ Himself is uncreated and as such - God.

Answer 2

Short Answer: The difference in these translations largely comes down to punctuation.

The problem is that in the era of ancient Greece, there was no concept similar to our contemporary system of punctuation. In fact, it wasn’t until hundreds of years after Christ’s time that the practice of punctuating sentences came into existence. Our earliest versions of both the Greek New Testament and the Hebrew Old Testament lack any form of punctuation.

Moreover, ancient Greek texts also did not incorporate spaces between words or paragraphs. The text was a just a continuous flow of letters, with occasional blank lines used to denote the conclusion of a significant section (although even this was not a consistent practice).

Furthermore, the concept of lower case letters was non-existent in ancient Greek. All texts were composed using capital letters.

This is usually not a problem for natives of Greek language. Take an English example:

CANYOUREADTHIS

Chances are that you could read this and figure out where the punctuation goes. Same with native speakers of Ancient Greek.

However, we are not native speaker of Ancient Greek. So, when there are different ways of dividing words or different sets of punctuation we typically need to look at the context for what the author intended. This, of course, requires some semblance of subjectivity.

Consider this from Vincent's Word Studies:

Who is over all, God blessed for ever (ὁ ὣν ἐπὶ πάντων Θεὸς εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας)

Authorities differ as to the punctuation; some placing a colon, and others a comma after flesh. This difference indicates the difference in the interpretation; some rendering as concerning the flesh Christ came. God who is over all be blessed for ever; thus making the words God, etc., a doxology: others, with the comma, the Christ, who is over all, God blessed forever; i.e., Christ is God

Also, consider the arguments presented by Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers which I have simplified:

1. Different Interpretations: The phrase is interpreted differently by different groups. Trinitarian and English interpreters generally interpret it as referring to Christ, while Socinian interpreters and some German scholars interpret it as a doxology addressed to God.
2. Order of Words: The order of the words in the phrase somewhat supports the interpretation that it refers to Christ. If it were a formal doxology, the blessing would likely come at the beginning.
3. Context: The context of the phrase also somewhat supports the interpretation that it refers to Christ. The sentence structure becomes abrupt if interpreted otherwise.
4. Usage of Words: However, the words “Who is over all” and the ascription of blessing are usually referred to God, not Christ, in other places in the Bible.
5. Title of God: The title “God” is not usually applied to Christ by St. Paul, although all the attributes of Godhead are ascribed to Him. St. John, on the other hand, does use this title for Christ.
6. Conclusion: Weighing all these arguments, he concludes that the data does not seem sufficient to warrant a definitive conclusion, but that the interpretation that the phrase refers to Christ appears slightly more probable.

References
Palmer, Micheal. “Punctuation in Ancient Greek Texts, Part i - Greek Language and Linguistics.” Greek Language and Linguistics - Ancient Greek, Mostly Hellenistic, 14 Feb. 2022, blog.greek-language.com/2022/02/14/punctuation-in-ancient-greek-texts-part-i/.

Answer 3

In this verse, as in other places, Paul has composed a statement saying Christ was God.

The First Evidence
This verse is the second time Paul made the statement ...blessed forever. Amen.

Romans (ESV)

because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. (1:25)
οἵτινες μετήλλαξαν την ἀλήθειαν τοῦ θεοῦ ἐν τῷ ψεύδει καὶ ἐσεβάσθησαν καὶ ἐλάτρευσαν τῇ κτίσει παρὰ τὸν κτίσαντα ὅς ἐστιν εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας ἀμήν

To them belong the patriarchs, and from their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ, who is God over all, blessed forever. Amen. (9:5)
ὧν οἱ πατέρες καὶ ἐξ ὧν ὁ Χριστὸς τὸ κατὰ σάρκα ὁ ὢν ἐπὶ πάντων θεὸς εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας ἀμήν

Paul used the phrase εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας ἀμήν, blessed to the ages amen when he first identified who was to be blessed: τὸν κτίσαντα ὅς ἐστιν, the Creator who is.

Here is a comparison of the two blessings:

1:25  τὸν κτίσαντα ὅς ἐστιν εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας ἀμήν
9:5   ὁ ὢν ἐπὶ πάντων θεὸς  εὐλογητὸς εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας ἀμήν

When a statement is repeated, the manner of the second must be understood in light of the first.

In the first, who is invoked is clear and unambiguous. The second alters the first construction. This change is enough evidence showing Paul intends Christ, who is God over all. If he did not intend this he would have repeated the form of the first τὸν θεὸν ὅς ἐστιν.

This is the first evidence Paul means to them belong the patriarchs and from their race, according to the flesh is the Christ, who is God overall, blessed forever. Amen

The Second Evidence
In the first praise Paul used ὅς ἐστιν, who is. In the second he used ὁ ὢν, the one being or the one who is. In addition to replacing ὅς ἐστιν with ὁ ὢν Paul composed a list of reasons why God should be blessed.

Romans 9:4-5a (DRA)

Who are Israelites, to whom belongeth the adoption as of children, and the glory, and the testament, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises. Whose are the fathers and of whom is Christ, according to the flesh, who is over all things...

This statement has been composed in a way which can be broken into two groups each beginning with the pronoun ὧν followed by items identified using the article

#1 - ὧν ἡ the divine adoption, and the glory, and the testament, and the giving
     of the law, and the service, and the promises
#2 - ὧν οἱ the patriarchs from ὧν ὁ the Christ, according to the flesh
     ὁ ὢν who is over all things

The singular Christ is from the plural the patriarchs. So ὧν οἱ becomes ὧν ὁ the Christ according to the flesh ὁ ὢν over all things. In so doing Paul recalls the name God gave to Moses:

And God said to Moyses, "I am THE ONE WHO IS." And he said, "Thus shall you say to the sons of Israel, 'THE ONE WHO IS has sent me to you.'" (LXX-Exodus 3:14)
καὶ εἶπεν ὁ θεὸς πρὸς Μωυσῆν ἐγώ εἰμι ὁ ὤν καὶ εἶπεν οὕτως ἐρεῗς τοῗς υἱοῗς Ισραηλ ὁ ὢν ἀπέσταλκέν με πρὸς ὑ

The phrase ὁ ὤν is the name the Lord gave Moses.

Conclusion
There are two reasons in support of the position Paul is expressing his belief Jesus is God. First, he unnecessarily changed the second blessing in order to use ὁ ὤν. Second, by placing ὁ ὤν at the end of a list of what God had done for the Jewish people, he recalled the name given to Moses.

The interpretation of Paul's second blessing is:

the Christ according to the flesh, THE ONE WHO IS God over all. Blessed forever. Amen.

Finally, by avoiding the name Jesus and using only the Christ, Paul puts Christ in the Exodus as he did in the first letter to the Corinthians.

1 Corinthians 10 (NIV)

¹ For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. ² They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. ³ They all ate the same spiritual food ⁴ and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

Answer 4

Note the observations of Ellicott in his “Commentary for English Readers” in Rom 9:5 which sums up the situation well and attempts to present an even-handed view of both sides:

Who is over all, God blessed for ever. - These words are a well-known subject for controversy. Trinitarian and English interpreters, as a rule, take them with the punctuation of the Authorised version, as referring to Christ. Socinian interpreters, with some of the most eminent among the Germans, put a full stop after “came,” and make the remainder of the verse a doxology addressed to God, “Blessed for ever be God, who is over all.” Both ways are possible. The question is, Which is the most natural and probable? and this is to be considered, putting altogether on one side prepossessions of every kind. We are not to read meaning into Scripture, but to elicit meaning from it. The balance of the argument stands thus:—

1. The order of the words is somewhat in favour of the application to Christ. If the clause had really been a formal doxology, the ascription of blessing would more naturally have come at the beginning in Greek as in English, “Blessed be God,” &c.
2. The context is also somewhat in favour of this application. The break in the form of the sentence becomes rather abrupt on the other hypothesis, and is not to be quite paralleled. Intruded doxologies, caused by a sudden access of pious feeling, are not uncommon in the writings of St. Paul, but they are either worked into the regular order of the sentence, as in Romans 1:25, Galatians 1:5, or else they are formally introduced as in 2 Corinthians 11:31; 1Timothy 1:17.
3. But on the other hand, to set somewhat decidedly against this application, is the fact that the words used by the Apostle, “Who is over all,” and the ascription of blessing in all other places where they occur, are referred, not to Christ, but to God. (Comp. Romans 1:25; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 2 Corinthians 11:31; Ephesians 1:3; Ephesians 4:6.) There is, indeed, a doxology addressed to Christ in 2 Timothy 4:18; it should, however, be remembered that the Pauline origin of that Epistle has been doubted by some, though it is also right to add that these doubts do not appear to have any real validity. The title “God” does not appear to be elsewhere applied to our Lord by St. Paul, though all the attributes of Godhead are ascribed to Him: e.g., in Philippians 2:6 et seq., Colossians 1:15 et seq. In 1 Timothy 3:16, which would be an apparent exception, the true reading is, * Who was manifested,” and not “God was manifested.” On the other hand, St. John certainly makes use of this title, not only in John 1:1; John 20:28, but also in the reading, adopted by many, of John 1:18, “God only begotten” for “Only begotten Son.”

Weighing the whole of the arguments against each other, the data do not seem to be sufficient to warrant a positive and dogmatic conclusion either way. The application to our Lord appears perhaps a little the more probable of the two. More than this cannot be said. Nor is a stronger affirmation warranted by any considerations resting on the division of authorities.

Actually, Ellicott is not quite correct in one of his assertions, that Paul never uses the title "God" for Christ. In fact there are several places where this occurs such as:

• Eph 5:5, “For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. [By Sharp’s rule, Paul calls Christ God here; Christ and God are the same person, ie, Christ is God.]
• Phil 2:5-8, “…Jesus Christ: who, being in very nature God…”
• Col 2:9 - For in Him all the fullness of the Deity dwells bodily. See also Col 1:19.
• 2 Thess 1:12, “…according to the grace of our God and Lord, Jesus Christ.”
• 1 Tim 3:16, “Who was revealed in flesh …” [The antecedent of “who” is God in v15, according to NA28/UBS5, etc. The Byzantine text makes this explicit: “God was revealed in flesh …”.]
• Titus 2:13, “…our great God and Saviour, Jesus Christ.” [This also has, “ho theos”.]

Now to the OP's original headline question, "Is Rom 9:5 evidence for Trinitarian Christology"? The answer is NO - at best it is evidence for Binitarian Christology as Rom 9:5 says nothing about the Holy Spirit.

Answer 5

Answer

Romans 9:5 is a Scriptural evidence to the fact that Jesus Christ is the only true God just as His Father is the only true God.

Nowhere is a son different from his father in nature and attributes.

Explanation

In this modern age we have easy access to the original sources of the Scripture in both Hebrew and Greek.

Let us study the original Greek of Romans 9:3-5:

“kinsmen of me according to flesh

Who are Israelites

Whose the divine adoption as sons and the glory and the covenants and the lawgiving and the service and the promises

Whose the patriarchs and

From whom Christ according to the flesh

the being (who is) over all God blessed to the ages Amen”.

In proper English, the above can be rephrased as:

“my relatives, according to the flesh, who are Israelites, whose is the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the lawgiving, and the service, and the promises, whose are the fathers, and of whom is the Christ, according to the flesh, who is God over all, blessed for all ages. Amen”.

Why RSV is Wrong

According to RSV, the last sentence reads like this:

“God who is over all be blessed for ever. Amen”.

In this, the verb “be” is added by the translators but is not in the Greek original.

The lack of a finite verb shows that the above is not a sentence or a clause. It is only a phrase and a phrase can never stand on its own!

A phrase is always a part of another sentence/clause.

Yet the RSV keeps it as a separate sentence.

The Greek has the last part as, “the being over all God blessed to the ages Amen”. In this, the word “blessed” is not a verb but an adjective. There are no verbs in here. So this is part of the previous sentence/clause.

[This is very important because in a previous train of thought, Paul does not bring in another thought abruptly without a proper verb. That is, Paul does not abuse a doxology improperly and out of place.]

Why NRSV Corrected

The same verse is corrected in the New RSV in 1989. There it reads:

“and from them, according to the flesh, comes the Messiah, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen” (biblia.com/books/nrsv/Ro9.5).

Now, the verb “be” is absent!

Now, “God blessed for ever” is a phrase that does not stand alone. It needs to stand together with the previous clause.

So the actual verse is:

“comes the Christ who is God over all blessed for ever, Amen”.

The rendering is unmistakable.

God-blessed?!

I couldn’t find such a phrase in the entire Bible! “God is blessed” or “God be blessed” or “blessed by God” or “God blessed them” etc are found in the Scripture.

But never have I come across a place where the term “God” is used as part of an adjective such as ‘someone is God-blessed”. Never. May be an oversight from my side? Then someone can correct me.

Conclusion

Notwithstanding the personal “prejudices” of the translators, the Greek Scripture strongly points to Jesus as “the Christ who is God over all blessed for ever”.

If Jesus is the “monogenes” Son of the only true God, by default, He has to be the same kind, that is, the only true God because a Son cannot be of a different nature than His Father**(*)**!

Otherwise, He will be an illegitimate Son!

[(*) However, we know that the son of John (YHWH) cannot be John (YHWH) himself. But, the son of a human being (God) is definitely a human being (God).]

Answer 6

Let us examine Romans 9:5, beginning with a similar statement in Romans 1:25

Romans 1:25 YLT

who did change the truth of God into a falsehood, and did honour and serve the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed to the ages. Amen.

Notice the word "Amen" at the end of Paul's praise to God. Note too that Jesus has not ever ascribed creation to himself as Matthew 19:4; Mark 10:6 and Mark 13:19 show. Jesus attributed creation to his God/Father.

Matthew 19:4 YLT

And he answering said to them, 'Did ye not read, that He who made them, from the beginning a male and a female made them,

Mark 10:6 YLT

but from the beginning of the creation, a male and a female God did make them

Mark 13:19 YLT

for those days shall be tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the creation that God created, till now, and may not be;

Checking Romans 9:5 YLT we find.

whose are the fathers, and of whom is the Christ, according to the flesh, who is over all, God blessed to the ages. Amen.

Again, Paul ends his praise to God with the word "Amen". Both verses have Paul's persuasion of truth against lying in the context. Notice also that both verses contain "blessed" or "blessed" be. Examining the words "blessed" be show that it refers only to the Father.

Mark 14:61 ASV

But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and saith unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?

2 Corinthians 1:3 ASV

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort;

2 Corinthians 11:31 YLT

the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ -- who is blessed to the ages -- hath known that I do not lie!

1 Peter 1:3 ASV

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The evidence show that the words "blessed" be refers only to the God and Father of Jesus Christ.

Romans 9:5 could not be use as evidence for Trinitarian Christo logy. Neither can it be used as evidence for Binitarian Christology. The following comments supports this.

In fact, on the basis of the general tenor of his theology it was considered tantamount to impossible that Paul would have expressed Christ's greeatness by calling him 'God blessed forever' "And nowhere else in his genuine epistles does Paul ever designate ho christos (the Christ) as theos ('God' or a 'god')."-p522. A Textual Commentary on the Greek New Testament, United Bible Societies, 1971

the words... refer not to Christ, but to the Father. (The Expositor's Greek New Testament, W.R. Nichol, Vol.2,p.659)

Paul's normal usage is to restrict "theos" ('God') to designate the Father (cf 1 Corinthians 8:6) (Dictionary of the Bible', p 318 Jesuit John L. Mckenzie, McMillan Publ., 1979 printing.)

The use of the word "blessed" ['eulogetos'] never occurs in the New Testament in reference to Christ (The Authorship of the Fourth Gospel', Ezra Abbot p. 361.)

In addition, if we examine the bible as a whole, it could not be affirmed that Paul placed Jesus in Exodus by using 1 Corinthians 10:1-3.

Examining the context we find that 1 Corinthians 10:11 say that these happened as "types".

And all these things as types did happen to those persons, and they were written for our admonition, to whom the end of the ages did come,

Reading Numbers 20:7-8 we find that the rock is not God. YHWH Himself, therefore, even if the rock in exodus typifies Christ, Christ is not the one referred to by Paul's use of "blessed" be.

Numbers 20:7-8 YLT

The LORD said to Moses, Take the staff, and you and your brother Aaron gather the assembly together. Speak to that rock before their eyes and it will pour out its water. You will bring water out of the rock for the community so they and their livestock can drink.”

Even if others claim that Jesus is also the true God because he is the son of the only true God and cannot be of a different nature than his Father is. This is similar to species talk.

The son of YHWH is YHWH"s son, not YHWH Himself. When Jesus is called the son of God, the bible is not telling us that Jesus is a member of the God species., but as the son of the one and only being who is God.

The term son of God is never used in the bible about God Himself.

Answer 7

RSV is the better.

The KJV was translated from the ancient texts a very long time ago. The NIV was translated from the KJV in the later 20 century. The RSV was translated in the mid 20th century. The RSV is the most trustworthy translation between the Old and New Testament.

The NIV translation is a highly corrupted translation of the Old Testament. It’s basically a USA propaganda translation for the evangelical after the Jim Crow era ended because of Rev. Martin Luther King. Sorry, American history is not really a strong point here amongst the users and the Bible. The KJV should be considered the most accurate because it was translated the longest ago so the translators should’ve been more knowledgeable about the ancient text languages than anybody alive today. However the KJV does contain all the famous interpolations of 1 John 5:8, Mark 16:14-20, John 8:1-11.

Roman 9 does not say that Jesus was God, and Psalm 2 does not say that the messiah king and Son was God. Romans 9 says the Israelites are the ancestors of the patriarchs, and the origin of the messiah and fleshly king who was king over all. God blessed the Israelites forever.

The KJV and RSV are the best translations compared to the NIV. The RSV is the better translation between the OT and NT and the most honest with interpolations.

I have physical copies of the KJV, NIV, RSV, right here at my hand that were printed before I was even born. RSV is the better of them all.